TravelTalkOnline Forums Travel and Vacation Forums British Virgin Islands North winds and seas

With the wind shift to North the seas are building quickly.

It was very calm and quiet in the Bite at Norman last night. Also quite crowded with powerboats rafted up around the edge near the restaurant. I guess the north shore could be very different picture.

Very weird winds for the BVI. The good news is they stay pretty light until Saturday. Forecast even has the winds clocking to the NW later in the week. Beam reach up the Francis Drake! The power boats you saw are the Puerto Rican navy arriving for Easter.

We arrive Sunday and set out on charter Monday. Looks like the the winds will be out the NE Monday and Tuesday. What are the prospects of sailing up the channel from Soper's Hole to Cooper? Looks like a heading of 90 degrees. Assuming the true wind at 45 degrees, I am thinking that too close to the wind for an Elba, but wanted to ask more experience hands.

Monohull or Cat? It’s still really a bit to far out to trust the forecast.

45 FP Elba catamaran. Regarding forecast accuracy, that is good to know.

If by sail you mean get there without motoring I would say pretty unlikely. If you're willing to motorsail then ok.

You can do it - but it will be a tacking slog the whole way up. I have friends I sail with who I'd do that with, but we can be a little crazy that way. If the Admiral is aboard, we'd be motorsailing at most! Game time decision based on your style of sailing!!!

Either way, have fun!!!


-Peter

Winds are currently forecast to be about 060. As mentioned that could change. You can certainly sail it but it’s going to take a long time. I like to sail so I come out of Sopers and hug the coast motoring for at least a mile. This gets me out of the current and the wind tends to lift a bit as you move up the SFD. Trying to tack right out of Sopers in a cat is an exercise in futility. The current is stronger down by Sopers. The one or two mikes of motoring helps greatly. I tend to sail from that point until the crew starts to threaten me. I motor from there!

Thank you for all the replies. Very helpful.

My wife and I are liveaboards and have sailed from Sopers under conditions similar to those anticipated early next week many times. Take GeorgeC1’s advice to heart. Our catamaran has 57HP diesels, and when necessary motor sails very well. We have done as GeorgeC1 suggested many times. We normally hug the coast out of Sopers for a solid 2nm (sometimes a little more), past the bay to port after Frenchman’s Cay. We then have been able to sail to Cooper or beyond with about 3 long tacks. Usually the biggest issue for us isn’t necessarily the wind, but the swell and wave action. It can really be an uncomfortable slog. If it’s too uncomfortable our bailout is the bight on Norman, occasionally Peter. We generally try to sail as much as possible, but I’m not adverse to motor sailing when needed.

Thanks for the reply and I will absolutely take that advice.

We are sailing with Waypoints out of USVI. Our plan, to the extent you can have one, was to check-in on Monday at JVD then work our way up the north side of Tortola, around the eastern end of Tortola and make our way over to North Sound. Traversing the north side of Tortola into in a NE wind would seem to be worse option in terms of comfort as opposed to SFD channel. If I am off base about that, let me know.

You are correct Bob. Listen to George

The Baths mooring field was closed today and it looks like some genius snapped a mooring and ended up on the rocks.

Oh no!! What kind of boat?

Mondays can be tough check-in days at JVD. This past Monday it took me about 2-1/2 hours of wait time in the office, broken up by going back to my boat, then a long lunch and picking up my passports after processing. Started at 10:15am, had passports back in hand around 4:00pm.

Going from west to east, the SFD channel is a bit more protected than up around the north side of Tortola as was pointed out by others. The boat that broke loose at The Baths looked like a Navigare cat (45'?). I don't know how it all turned out. The photo I saw the tender had broken loose on one end and it's gas tank was floating nearby. North swell, red flag = no bueno.

BVI Charter Chat on FB has a long thread on the Baths incident. Navigare FP (42). Combo of wind and swell apparently snapped the mooring. People need to understand that red flags mean no mooring. Period. Navigare posted that the guests were safe and being comforted on another boat
. 😳

Do any of the charter companies do online education and testing? Navigare's screening (or lack thereof) of captains has been discussed, but it seems that online training and a test could improve outcomes. Captains might better absorb information in advance than after a long day's travel while they're worrying about their booze delivery.

Subjects like color coding of flags and bouys would lend themselves to online education, but there are probably many topics which could be included.

There was a dinghy accident (person in the water) at CGB on Thursday at the dinghy dock so an eye witness told us. No injuries apparently. But the swell can be nasty there.

The incident at The Baths is quite similar to the Hillbilly debacle. The Hillbilly didn’t have the benefit of Red Flag warnings but an experienced skipper shouldn’t need a flag of any color to guide his/her decisions. I do understand how a bareboater, especially with several guests or family on board, can overlook questionable conditions while trying to entertain shipmates and hit all the high spots during a 7 or 10-day charter. Not saying it’s smart or responsible, just that I can understand how it happens.

Many years ago we were at The Baths and I don’t recall a red flag out, but we realized upon catching the mooring that getting the dinghy off the davits was going to be difficult. Someone suggested we “just swim in”. My wife immediately squashed the idea and we told our 6 guests the conditions were untenable. Dropped the mooring, headed to North Sound, taxied over. It made for a short day at The Baths, but still tons of fun. If we had been able to deploy the dinghy, we might have headed to shore and left the boat. Now, 24 years later, I would not even pick up a mooring in those conditions. Live and learn, and thank goodness for smart spouses.

As a family, we now have about 12 to 14 weeks of charter experience in the BVI, and we are still learning. Here is an idea - recognizing that there are some bull-headed people who charter these boats - but my guess is that most really want to learn prior to chartering.

Maybe there should be a "List of Lessons" created to teach best practices categorized by each facet of the adventure (dinghy, anchoring, mooring, how to use the toilets, water usage, navigating, safety, docking, etc.). The people on this forum could come up with 5 or 10 quickly in each category, so I can only imagine what the base teams could come up with given the things they have seen. For example, in the mooring and safety categories, don't moor a huge boat in heavier winds and seas since the wind and swell put extra pressure on the mooring hardware! In the dinghy section, don't try to beach a dinghy in swell, and especially don't stand between a dinghy and the beach in swell.

The lessons could be 2 to 4 sentences each (with exceptions where needed) and the documents could be like an FAQ where new things are added over time.

Maybe this has been done - if so, I haven't seen it.

Great idea...I am always lookign to find out what I dont know I dont know...here are some excerpts from my captain's briefing to start

Captains Briefing (SLOW IS PRO)
1) Life Jackets-where are they? Life Boat. Tie a life jacket to back railing
2) Emergency equipment-VHF (Channel 16) flares, fire extinguishers. VISAR is rescue team.
3) Man Overboard Drill-Shout, Throw & Point. Don’t take you eyes of the person in the water. CONSTANT EYE CONTACT. Throw the life ring in and the life jacket in.
4) Always count heads…can you count to “10” or however many people we have on board
5) Securing safety railings at all times…holding yourself in back.
6) One hand for you one for the boat (3 points of contact at ALL times)…when we moor or dock or leave mooring if you aren’t doing anything for the boat stay seated and if it doesn’t involve the boat or boat safety don’t talk to me. Use hand rails at all times. Don’t carry something onto the boat or dinghy. 1st person cross and then hand gear.
7) Tank water is for bathing ONLY
8) Head (toilet) operation & red-light location…if it doesn’t come out of you it doesn’t go down the toilet
9) Stay hydrated-if you aren’t peeing you aren’t drinking enough
10) No night swimming-Rule of 3 wherever you go
11) Mooring-3 people up front. 1 on port line and 1 on starboard and one in middle with boat hook. Lines need go under rail and through eyehook and then brought back and tied. Manning the boat hook to pick up the mooring painter eye hook. Communicate with captain. DO NOT GET BETWEEN BOAT and anything HARD...no human fenders.
12) Docking-people on lines and people on fenders. Hold fender line at right height. Don’t use your body or any other part between boat and dock. Don’t push off the dock hard and fast and don’t pull a rope hard and fast. If I need you to snug a line wrap around cleat once and hold. Simple Cleat hitch knot….
13) Fire-Get everyone up and out.
14) Gas line – Light and breaker. If gas on one person must stay with oven/burner.
15) Everyone is a lookout for boats and anything else
16) Dinghy-stay on sides and not in front. Shift lever. One person hold dinghy rope (painter) tight while others boarding. Dinghy needs to be tied down on elevator. Dinghy kill switch. Dinghy tilt engine. Colored bags on dinghy
17) If you stay below while moving and you get seasick you will be a boating buzzkill. Stay ahead of any potential seasickness
18) Get enough sleep…if you need eyemask bring it. No ear plugs
19) Social media-be smart about being dumb. It is forever. Switch off data on phone
20) Questions…ask ask ask…don’t be shy and don’t wait. If there is something I should know let me know….if you need something let me know.

I think some people don't appreciate WHY not to pick up a mooring in fairly shallow water in a swell, as at the Baths.
I think people assume it's about swimmer safety.

Without the weight and catenary of a chain rode, moorings can only rely on the stretch of the nylon lines to absorb shock loads.
As I recall, maximum elongation of nylon is around 10-20%. A big boat lifted by the swell exerts tremendous force that WILL break the line if the ability to stretch is exceeded. That's assuming the anchor doesn't pull out first.

I recall my first charter with the Moorings (some time in the early 1980's) we had the "friendly skipper" on board. We came out of Road Harbor into the channel and started sailing. Our "friendly skipper" threw a cushion overboard and called for a man overboard drill. We were able to execute it pretty well. The "friendly skipper" said he was OK with us taking the boat and we took him over to Peter Island to catch the ferry back. On the way to Peter Island we (myself and our crew) had a lively discussion with our "friendly skipper" about how to improve our overboard drill. It was a very educational experience. I wonder if any of the charter agencies do anything like that these days . . .

Red flag again today at the Baths and I just a picture on Facebook with about 8 boats on the mooring balls.

That makes me sad. I suppose the boaters just don’t care about safety and their, or other’s, property.

Hanlons Razor-dont think malice as much as stupidity.