TravelTalkOnline Forums Travel and Vacation Forums British Virgin Islands NPT Mooring Irritation

Just got back from a great trip and am currently sitting at my desk at work still rocking. I picked up my boat at CYOA which was - as expected but still greatly appreciated - in perfect working condition inside and out.

I like to think I'm pretty easy going and probably 5x more so while down in the ilons. But one thing I'm a little irritated with is the NPT moorings. I don't mind spending the money for the permit 'cause I feel like it's being used to support things I take direct advantage of. But I ought to be able to take advantage of the moorings else I'm not really sure what I'm paying for.

For example - I arrive at the Indians at 0700 on Sunday. Every mooring ball has a CAT parked on it except two. Of the two only one of the balls has a lead. ok.. fine for me I pick up the remaining ball. There is no way the cats got there in the morning - I'm certain they were there all night. No sign of life on them. We stayed on our mooring for at most the maximum 90 minutes. None of the "parked" boats moved in that time or showed any sign of life. Several other boats came by looking for a ball and left - no room at the inn.

Same experience at the Baths. Packed. In the 20 minutes I hung out not a single boat left. Hard to believe they all got there within the previous 90 minutes. No big deal at this site 'cause I rented a car and drove down from Leverick. Better that way anyway. But it does make me wonder why I bother paying the NPT permit.

It appears some boaters believe the rules are for the little people. I find this a bit annoying!

I agree. Unfortunately, a lot of people are pigs, and you find these pigish people everywhere you go.

(My apologies to pigs.)

Never fight with pigs..you both get dirty and the pig enjoys it!

I agree

People feel entitled and without any sort of effective enforcement that behavior is only going to get worse. I would pay more for the NP Permit if it meant that enforcement of the rules would happen!

I too find this annoying. The Baths, I think is one exception - you really need 2 hours there at least. But all the other sites, 90 minutes is reasonable and you can then move.

It is unfortunate there is no enforcement of the rules at all. And more unfortunate that more people don't have respect for others. We always try to stick to 90 minutes or less.. only exceptions we make are if there's free balls.. if there are, then we don't rush to leave.

I wonder if some of it is people not knowing the rules.

Doubt it.

I'm sure there are some that don't know the rules, but I also think they are the minority.

In the Summer often you get the Sailing School/Camps over nighting as it the "easy way" to get all the boats together and I imagine not spend money.

I've overheard people in bars brag about saving $30 by overnighting at the Park moorings. But in some cases the overnighters are desperate charterers who grab any available ball because they don't trust that heavy thing on the bow. If the Bight is full, quick - head over to the Indians.

I will post a longer review of the week. Observed the same things you did. Dead calm the first 4 days with people overnighting on park buoys everywhere.
G

Interesting that folks are leaving boats unattended at the Baths and Indians. I thought Moorings/Sunsail required that someone stay on board at all times when hooked to a NPT ball due to the poor condition of the ground tackle and pendants.

Yea... I think you are probably right - that's very likely what is going on. As I'm thinking about it it's not the fact that these people are using the NPT mooring for overnight that's annoying to me - that doesn't really affect me. But if you are going to overnight on the NPT mooring at least get off of it at first light so your lack of planning doesn't affect everyone else. IMHO.

Saturday we picked up the last mooring ball on Cooper at 10:30 in the morning. Never seen that before. I enjoy Cooper but I'm not willing to give up a day of sailing (not sure it's called "sailing" when there is zippo wind but you get the point) just so I can be at Cooper. But that's how it worked out this time.

So when we visit the Baths we slip our mooring at first light at Marina Cay and usually get to the Baths at 7am, having had breakfast on the way. I've had several boaters angrily accuse me of staying there over night, but no, this is the one day in our trip that it pays to start early, and we do.

I agree with the above... it's hard to see the Baths in 90-min.

We're usually gone by 9am when most of the boats start showing up.

We do somewhat the same thing as Twanger with the Indians. Get off our ball at first light from Norman, motor over, and snorkel while some folks are having breakfast and some snorkel. Then we move on with our plan for the day.

I read a lot of complaints but no realistic solutions to charter boats simply ignoring the clearly stated rules on their NPT receipt.
Who is the BVI agency responsible for enforcement anyway?
A predawn boat leaving Tortola and arriving at 1st light at the Indians or other NPT sites will result in fines, p*ss off the charterers, and solve the problem for a few hours.
A pre-sunset visit by the same 'unknown agency' will result in fines and quite a few vessels moving in near darkness to search for alternative for the night.
The next week the same problems will surface as a new set of charter boats fail to observe the same rules.
To me it is clearly a mix of disrespect, ignorance, entitlement, abuse, no consequences of their transgression and little practical enforcement activity.
Sailors who do observe courtesy and common regard for the rules are penalized.
Can anyone envision a workable, practical way to solve this blatant disregard for the NPT overnighting problem.

Once 2 or 3 boats are clearly moored for the night at an NPT site it seems to be a magnet for more boats to join them under the "they are doing it" reasoning.

I have never heard this, how would you go to dinner or go diving

This was part of the Moorings briefing a couple of years ago. They made have changed it since if the condition of the NPT moorings improved.

Only downside is this is really the worst time of day to see the indians. Best time is noon or so when the sun is nearly directly over head. Or even a little in the day so the light is better for seeing things.

My opinion - the BVI is not very good at enforcing rules in a meaningful but non-draconian way. Take a look at the fishing rules - violators can have their boats impounded? A bit heavy handed IMHO.

If it was me (and it's not) - I would fine them. But not force them to move. Forcing them to move would probably be unsafe and might penalize the wrong people (the boat owners). I would institute hours that you can use the moorings. Say 0600 to 1900. If you're on the mooring ball outside these hours it's a $500 fine. When you pick up your NPT permit this is explained to you just in case you can't read. Problem goes away in a few months and raises some money for the BVI treasury. And the moorings can be used for their intended purpose. That's what I would do if I ran the zoo.

I agree with that. Quick fine - on the spot - which the agency would work with the charter company to enforce as well. No requirement to move if after sunset or close to sunset. Random swing past in the day to ensure the 90 min limit is enforced. Would generate decent income for the treasury, for a short period of time till the charter companies spread the word about how serious the agency is.

Same applies to charter boats taking up the commercial dive boat moorings as well... I have seen arguments develop between commercial dive boats and charter boat crews, bringing a paying group to dive a site, only to see a big cat sitting at the dive boat mooring with no plan to move on.

Sometimes people forget the fact that need to pay attention to customs and rules, even if it gets in the way of their holiday plan!

Certainly the day will come where the powers that be employ "rangers" to "help" us all remain "safe". I am more than positive the collective we will not enjoy the "support" from at least some of these empowered rangers. The other plan long discussed to to raise the fees significantly and limit the visitors at any given times. Some areas far away from the BVI also close reefs on a rotating basis to allow nature to recover. That practice is not different than the hunting and fishing seasons many are familiar with. Be careful what you wish for.

A good plan -- but as I asked - who does the enforcement??
And I doubt the problem will go away in a few months unless the powers that be strictly do the enforcement and it is widely publicized.
@Sailtowind mentions "be careful what you wish for"

"If I ran the zoo" ----- not a job anyone would really wish for IMHO!!

You guys remember my 2016 April fool?
METERS WITH NASTY HORNS ON NPT MOORING BALLS?
OK... Who is laughing now? <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Grin.gif" alt="" />

I didn't know I needed to have a complete solution to the problem in order to be annoyed by the present conditions.

I don't really care how they enforce their own rules. But not enforcing them doesn't appear to be working. And I'm not sure why you and Sailtowind believe that the current completely broken usage of the NPT mooring balls is surely better than some enforcement. As is now I pay for a NPT permit that I accept has rules for fair play and I find out that some percentage of sailors don't want to be bothered by those rules which impacts my usage that I paid for.

But to get back to your point. If they are NPT moorings I would think the BVI Park service would enforce those rules. They already have a boat - I've seen them enforce the swim area at the Baths before. I assume they can drive that boat and enforce some rules with their current personnel. Second idea would be for the NPT to contract out the mooring balls, maintenance, and enforcement to a private party and simply take a percentage of the revenue. That would probably be a better solution but I doubt it would fly in the BVI.

Despite finding a solution to the problem not really being my problem I've suggested some strawman ideas to make it better. You are welcome to put forth other constructive ideas which IMHO would be better input than "that would never work".

To enforce the rules fairly they would need to time every boat that took a mooring.

I'm not going to pretend to have the solutions and even if I did I doubt it would matter. However - I don't see why the rules have to be applied fairly. If I'm pulled over for speeding I have to face the consequences. Telling the officer that other people were speeding as well has no bearing. The enforcement of the mooring balls could be completely random. Similar to speeding it's the threat that you could be caught that modifies behavior. Behavior takes a while to change - it would likely take several months before the situation gets better. And similar, failure to enforce the stated rules the situation will continue to get worse and soon the whole point of the NPT mooring balls will be lost due to bad selfish behavior that has no consequences. IMHO.

Cities all over the world have figured out reasonable, and cost-effective, ways to enforce parking laws. Seriously. How difficult can this be?

Nobody cares about enforcement, or the quality of the NPT services. They care about the fee revenue. Enforcement costs would cut into that, so therefore it is a non-starter.

I personally think that there is likely some middle ground between an enforcement police state and the existing "tragedy of the commons", but there certainly doesn't seem to be any driver for the NPT to do anything about it. Maybe the major stakeholders (ie the charter co's) could muster some interest since it is the experience they are selling that is affected.

If I ran the NPT I would use a crowdsourced solution in consultation with other stakeholders like scuba operators, day sail charters, and charter operators. Start a website that does some "naming and shaming" - You could send photos with boatnames, time and date stamps, and the charter operators can see who the rule breakers are and perform whatever remedial action they deem appropriate.

And I am not sure why you believe that I feel the current misuse of NPT moorings is surely better.
That is simply not true and I do feel 'some enforcement' would be worthwhile - I just asked if anyone had any workable and practical ways to do it. I did say you had a good plan and if the Park Service boat operates there at sunrise or sunset it may well have some moderate effect. <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Thumbsup.gif" alt="" />

It is just one of the many reasons I rarely sail the BVI anymore - which is especially disheartening for me - I enjoyed sailing around there for many years, and worse I can even see a few of my old favorite BVI's from my front porch here on STT.

Actually it's not difficult to enforce the law on the moorings and it would be profitable.
All they have to do is have one person on a boat to take pictures of all the boats on a mooring which will also state the time and 90 minutes later any boat still there will be fined.
The fine would be sent directly to the charter company with the picture.

I'm not sure its that simple though. What if there are balls free? Does someone still need to leave? Maybe for 3 hours, there's been 2 balls free so people remain. I really don't see any issue with that. As soon as things fill up though, its time to go.

I think really what is needed even more so then enforcement is education. I think a LOT of people simply don't know there's a time limit.

The simplest way to deal with parking beyond the limits is a combination of electronically controlled "mooring" tie-ups and radio signals when there is an overtime violation. The charter boat companies must want to see this problem solved even if the government does not dare to care. You will not need a fleet of mooring cops, and the fines will roll in from those who don't "know" the rules

I think we have different definitions of what constitutes "simple" :-)

I can't imagine what it would take to keep that kind of system maintained and functional in that environment.

Monitoring does not need to be continuous. A few random passes a month at 9PM to take boat names and sent the charter company a bill for a $500 fine and the word would get around pretty quickly. The fear of enforcement is often more effective than enforcement itself.

100% agree with that <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Clapping.gif" alt="" />

Pay the person a decent percentage of the fine and they will have plenty of people willing to help enforce it.

I suppose that a simple solution would be to just hike the permit fee and install more moorings until a saturation point is achieved.

Alternatively, Orca Green Marine is working on a new solar powered charging station mooring ball that could probably be modified to provide a potential monitoring/electronic fee collection solution. Saw a prototype of the ball at the Annapolis Boatshow last fall. Their plan is to market it to municipalities.

Here's another solution; motor until you're out of the park area (they're generally small) then anchor and dink back in. Or, simply move on. There are plenty of attractions to see - no need to get all bent up, especially when on vacation down there <img src="http://www.traveltalkonline.com/forums/images/graemlins/Cheers.gif" alt="" />
Note: I was just there last week (Voyage 600 Jus' Chillin). Our times overlapped at least a little. I never had a problem getting a ball anywhere (Baths, Indians, White Bay, The Bight, Saba/BEYC, etc.).