TravelTalkOnline Forums Travel and Vacation Forums St. Maarten - St. Martin Sonesta Great Bay to become Planet Hollywood

Update from Sunwing and Great Bay Resort:

"As you may or may not know, the Sunwing Travel Group owns a hotel company called Blue Diamond Resorts, based in Barbados, which operates over 15,000 rooms throughout the Caribbean (www.bluediamondresorts.com). Within our hotel operations we have seven different brands which offer different experiences and levels of quality. I am happy to advise that we have picked our newest and most vibrant luxury brand, Planet Hollywood (www.planethollywoodhotels.com ) , to be the flag on the new hotel in Sint Maarten. We believe that this brand will allow us to achieve a higher daily rate and bring a level of cache to SXM which will be required in order to jump start the destination. The hotel will feature the following:

- 450 rooms (depending on whether we get the permits for the increased height)
- 5 restaurants including a burger joint from the famous TV personality, Guy Fieri
- 20,000 sq ft Casino
- A Planet Hollywood Beach Club on the adjacent land.
- A world class spa

And much more"

Hi. Link????

That was put out by the company. I'll edit to show quotation marks.

Put out by the company WHERE????? It looks to be a copy and paste from Jeff Berger's newsletter to me, which is a copyrighted publication. If you can't show me where this is posted on something OTHER than Berger's newsletter, I'm going to delete this unless you have his permission to post it.

It was off another facebook page. Not Jeff Bergers but Simply SXM which is not copyrighted.

OK

Not trying to be silly, but can a FB page even BE copyrighted? I know it can be sold to other countries! lol

Carol,
This information was posted originally by the chair of condo association at Great Bay Sonesta George Nasello. So I would say it is legitimate info

Of course, we all recall when Planet Hollywood Casino was coming to Simpson Bay Resorts!! That was supposed to be a done thing also. But if they do come, I think it would be a good thing for the island and provide some much needed exposure..

This is interesting. I am sure if we look in the way back machine you will find posts about PH looking to partner with Royal Resorts (Simpson Bay Resort) about 4/5 years ago. But he deal was nixed. This was more than a rumor at the time and it was part of SBR sales pitch back then....

Kudos Carol. Looks like we are typing the same thing at the same time.

Yup, great minds!!

Strange there is no mention of SXM but the Great Bay Resort has been demolished?

Planet Hollywood Beach Resort Costa Rica will open in the fall of 2018 and Planet Hollywood Resort Cancun will open in late Spring of 2019...

https://www.planethollywoodhotels.c...-and-planet-hollywood-create-partnership

From the original post.. "450 rooms (depending on whether we get the permits for the increased height)" Perhaps the whole project is not a done deal, until said permits are obtained.

In the soualigane news too.
https://soualiganewsday.com/local/s...room-planet-hollywood-resort-casino.html

Again, the Planet Hollywood at SBR was also announced numerous places. But I do hope that it happens..

We met a lovely couple from Canada a few years ago who owned a condo at Sonesta Great Bay. I wonder what happens to their ownership through this change. Anyone have any Thoughts? 😊😊

Would be interesting to find out if they received any payment for their loss. Its different when a resort changes hands. Right to use or ownership usually transfers over. A complete demolition with another resort rebuilding from ground up would be different. Could be a long court battle like the Alegrea mess.

Planet Hollywood on St Martin! How incredibly horrible is that? I am all for the redevelopment of the island and bringing people back to SXM but there are many great ways in doing so and this isn't one of them. If you have ever been on one of their properties you would know that Planet Hollywood Brand/Resorts is a low grade, sad excuse for a hotel/Spa. The fact that Guy's Burger Joint is one of the draws says it all!! If you want to go to Vegas or go on one of the many themed cruise ships that offer equivalent accommodations, then do. But to irect something like this on the island is very unfortunate.

I'm going to agree to disagree with you on this one. Planet Hollywood has HUGE coffers for advertising. I think it's very much a chance for a whole new group of people to discover St. Maarten/St. Martin. As several people have noted lately, the demographic of SXM tourists continues to get older and older. Some of that is the generation who bought timeshares is getting older, but SXM has always had an older clientele than places like Cancun. I'm not saying SXM should become Cancun, but some younger tourists would be good for the country, I think.

Now, as far as timeshare owners, I guess I never knew that there were t/s owners there. I always thought of it as an a/I hotel. Based on recent events, it's probably logical to 'assume' that the t/s owners will get fleeced, IF this thing happens.

Several thoughts here:

1. I was wrong...(Carol you can correct me here) PH was NOT involved in a possible SBR merger. It was Hard Rock Cafe. That deal fell though for a couple of reasons (my understanding): Namely it was going to be very difficult for HR to open up a casino on the island without partnering with one of the current "local" Casino owners. Foreign casinos are restricted by law. The second was the drawn out legal battles with the bankruptcy, foreclosure etc.

2. I don't think there will be a swift dramatic shift in SXM's tourist demographic. Reasons being. A. There are many "Cancun" like options around the Caribbean and Gulf. Cheap destinations...all inclusive resorts abound. SXM to me has a different vibe and I just don't see it changing dramatically. B. SXM has a disadvantage as to distance and the "relative" high cost to get there.

3. Planet Hollywood is not awful. I travel frequently for conventions and business and I have spent my fare share at PH (and Hard Rock) in Vegas and their other properties. They are not bad. Yes, it tends to be Kitchy but the service, food accommodations are above average if not great (depends on property)

4. Keep in mind the main goal for any of these "new" developments is to keep their guests ON PROPERTY. They want them to spend their $$$$ with them. Nowhere else. That was a criticism I had with SBR early on. They aren't making money because they have very little incentive for people to stay there on property (dining, drinking etc...). In fact, SBR has made many changes over the years to change that...its a good thing. Point, being many new people may come...however... you may only see them at the airport. If it provides jobs and an uplift to the local economy I am for it.

I could go on here.... but it is still morning and I should be working. Note: my wisdom and logic would be crystal clear on a beach with a cocktail in my hand...as far as I know....

OK, could be it was Hard Rock, not Planet Hollywood. I don't really remember what all the problems were..

Regarding your 4th point, SXM as a destination has always been different than many other destinations, in which people spend their whole vacation on site at their hotel. Planet Hollywood will not change that, I don't think. BUT it may get some people who otherwise would not consider SXM to come, with the potential familiarity of the brand, like at the Westin. It's an opportunity also for conventions. And then the NEXT time they come, they would stay somewhere else. Or not. Regardless there still will be local people employed at the hotel, if nothing else..

As is always the case, there are pros and cons but in all honesty, I’m not worried about it one way or the other. It is what it is and it will be what it will be. By the time it’s actually built and operational and then around long enough to have any possible negative impact, which I do think in the long run is distinctly possible, I think my SXM days will be done.....

The island needs tourist dollars NOW so I just hope the places we all know and love can have their repairs happen a lot sooner than this proposed change will come to pass and the Island can benefit from all of it.

Wow.....you know one of the issues that people have with a place like Aruba as an example, is that they have become to Americanized. SXM, especially on the French side has tended to stay away from that complaint. PH will not help.....hate to see a lot of young people in SXM.....would like the island to continue to be a little slice of Europe in the Caribbean. JMHO

Considering the changes on Sxm over many years!!!! Would rather go back than have more unpopular development that again takes away from this once beautiful Island..We have been going since the mid 80s, and looking back is so wonderful... the beauty of the Island , the scenery, the simple but wonderful resturants with always a beautiful view. the days and nights going out without fear... Of course there will be progress, but over development has taken all away. I say let resorts there come back, but leave this Island alone... This is not miami, I for one have been part and seen the changes... Sorry, not for the better... I can remember sitting in frigit steak house surrounded by nature... Never will be again.... thats my opinion... Oh and by the way!!!! young people are great, but for the most part will not add to bring money to Island... This Island was at one time for people with money that wanted privacy... I know thats done, but let6s not turn this into a circus...

The only contribution Planet Hollywood will bring to SXM will be more Americanization to this culturally rich Dutch and French island. With that said, not even a tasteful version of the USA will be presented! Properties opening on the island should be focused on providing first rate "unique to SXM" accommodations to their guests while promoting local businesses and exposing them to all the greatness the island has to offer. There are those people who come to St Martin and sit at one resort and only know one route on the island and that is going to and from the airport. Thats very unfortunate for them. Islands like Jamaica and the DR warent that type of vacationing for many reasons including safety factors. The island of St. Martin offers its visitors amazing opportunities on all levels and that should be promoted from these properties - not kitschy- tacky Hollywood BS that has nothing to do with anything on the island. As for attracting a youthful crowd, that is vital but once again, not the youthful crowd that this property will bring to the island. There are proper ways of introducing this island to a new crowd of people and this isn it! Over developed Vegas, Cancun. Aruba, Orlando, Bahamas - thats PH's demographic, not SXM.

My opinion isn't popular, but that's OK. I would ask you though how you would encourage a younger tourist demographic to SXM?

I'm in agreement with PH not being all that bad. As all of us age and no longer can afford or for health reasons continue to vacation in St Maarten, we need that younger crowd to become frequent visitors for the health of the island and the benefit of all. Many of the people on this forum started going there at a much younger age than their current age is now. Think back how old you were on your first visit.

I think a good question to ask is, "what is the demographic of island visitors each year?" and "is there actually a deficit of young travelers to SXM?" I can't answer that but I can tell you one thing - building a Tacky Themed Vegas Resort Casino is not the answer to attracting the young crowd that will love and embrace SXM and make it their future caribbean home. Thats not what these properties are about and what they attract. They won't be promoting the island, they are promoting their brand ( PLANET HOLLYWOOD) and that there is yet another one of these all inclusive atrocities that their clientele can go to - same thing new location. They bank on their customers to never leave the property except for airport departure and to say "Wow, PH is always an amazing resort - can't wait to go to the new one in .... next time", not "wow SXM is an amazing island that i can't wait to come back to on my next vacation. I believe thats what everyone is thinking needs to happen for the health of SXM and it won't necessarily be happening with this crowd/resort. Plus, by bringing something like Planet Hollywood to SXM, it just really cheapens the island as a whole. Seriously Unfortunate!

Right now everyone is looking for unique, luxury and exclusivity. If in fact there is need for youth, the Island really needs to bring in boutique properties that will make the island more unique to the younger clientele with style but still keep a sense of island branding sophistication. That is what has been the surge in hospitality world wide and has brought young clientele to places you would never think would go. Attract young couples or family;'s that will continue to come back for more and perhaps invest in the island. ST Martin is an amazing island - there are many ways to do it without opening the door to something as ridiculous as PH. Its really a shame that the Dutch will allow anything to be built in ST. Martin. Thats what may be the real demise of the island.

It almost seems like your objection is to an all inclusive. Well, the last I checked, most people who went to Great Bay went a/I. In fact, I didn't know that there was anything other than a/I there. And I really don't know whether they will be offering a/I here, but I assume that's what they do. My feeling is that you should give potential visitors to Planet Hollywood a little bit more credit than to assume that they all would just spend their entire time at the resort . Kind of like the opinion many people have of cruise ship passengers.

Regardless, all of this may be an esoteric argument, as they may not even come. While there have been a bunch of holidays recently, so there haven't been many Daily Heralds recently, I am surprised there has not been anything in there yet (unless I missed it)

We tend to agree with you. We have always considered SXM a prime spot for us to get away from the circus-like atmosphere of places like Vegas, Cancun, Bahamas, etc. We love the European feel of SXM and are not sure PH would contribute anything to that. The Americanization of Aruba was the main reason we didn't care for it.

Perhaps the younger people who have grown up coming to SXM with their parents will continue the tradition in the years to come; or perhaps others will discover it like we did -- via a cruise -- and then return because they fall in love with the 'difference' that is SXM.

I welcome a new resort but I believe PH is not the best choice for SXM...

Research and travel trends will show that although cruise travel is popular with all generations an all-inclusive resort is not.

Boomer, Millennial, Gen-Xer and Gen-Zer travel trends...

http://globetrendermagazine.com/2017/05/19/travel-trends-across-generations/

Club Orient is going to have to market to the Millenials, Gen-Xer and Gen-Zers.

Here is a cute article addressing marketing.

"Words are words, but words change the world. They define people. And those definitions can mean a lot.

So what should we be saying to this brave new generation of Snapchat and Instagram?"

Go Nude.

Get Nude.

https://nudemovement.org/2016/07/30/why-i-no-longer-call-myself-a-nudist/

I think its ok to want a young crowd to visit Sxm, However keep in mind!!! Young folks are working to pay bills and keep food on the table. for the most part they vacation on a strict budget. We started going to Island in our 40s, and already raised our children. We built our home in the middle 80s in Island. But the years prior where very lean. No vacations, just work... So my point is??? Unless your a young person with alot of money, and there are!!! Vacations are far and few. I do not believe for the most part, asking for young people will bring alot to the Island in the way of spending... But again!! My memory of The Sxm of past, was much different than now, and I am not trying to be negative, but so miss the raw beauty of the Island... I for one have no desire to see any more structures than they already have, and over development means more loss of the once was natural beauty of this Island... No I for one would not want to see Planet hollywood, would rather see the ocean from every angle...

This is a good question. And my answer is: Not PH.

I know PH in SXM, causes trepidation because some feel it will attract an undesirable younger demographic. I disagree. I don't think PH is going to attract any different type of tourist than SXM normally attracts. Here is why:

1. PH is NOT really going to attract young people. Quite frankly it is a very tired brand. It used to be everywhere and now they are down to 8 restaurants! (bankrupt Twice - Delisted stock) The hotels are relatively new thing and they only have one established hotel in the entire US (Las Vegas - actually owned by Caesars). I have been to that hotel. Its just fine, for "Vegas". (that is saying a lot for me because I have visit Vegas often, always for business and never for fun) Caesars is most likely franchising/licensing licensing the name and that may change at a drop of a hat. Its Vegas.

2. PH Hollywood has only one other functioning hotel outside the US. Its in Goa. Why? I don't know .... They have another AI resort opening in Costa Rica soon, but that seems to be it. SO I believe this SXM venture is pure licensing of the name and who knows where that would go....the whole thing seems desperate and destined to not happen.

3. SXM will always change. Sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. I know many lament that the days when it was sleepy little island are now long gone. I wish I was there to see it. But I was one of those "young" people who arrived on the island in the early '00s. I have seen many positive changes. And what attracted me was the beaches, low cost of living (once you get here), and accessibility to just about everything you need (groceries, etc...). We are snorkeling beach bums who love to cook and don't dine out often. Setting up in a beach side accommodation is all we wanted and that's what will keep us coming back. Does the island's economy benefit from us? I hope so.

Final note. Recently I read a comments on a SXM Facebook group. There was a discussion between two long time SXM visitors about how they hated the "new" young people showing up and ruining their peace at SBR (Pelican). One actually bragged how they would stake out a pool and tell kids (lying) that would arrive that it was an Adults only pool. Others applauded there ingenuity and said they did the same, I just about lost it ....but did not comment. I hope to see all of them soon and plop my daughter right next to them.... Point is the island will change. It will always will change, but so should attitudes. It will never become an, Orlando, Cancun, Padre, Vegas...but that's another thread.

Great post, Wabid, and as one of those lucky few who did discover the Island 45 years ago and who has watched it change over the years, I hope you’re right and this is merely a branding issue. There should be something for everyone and while all those ‘somethings’ aren’t necessarily my ‘somethings’ I’m glad we can all enjoy this place we love, each in our own way. And as I said in an earlier post, if all those worse fears are realized and the Island does change beyond my enjoyment or tolerance level, they call that life and I am free to either change with it or move on.

OK, well, shows you what I know about Planet Hollywood, as I don't really follow these things. If Caesars is just licensing the name, they may run out of money, or it may not ever come to pass. But regardless of what some folks think, I am firmly convinced that if SXM is going to survive, it needs an influx of younger people, as the current demographic continues to get older and older.

I would seriously watch what you ask for on this one. Do not worry about SXM surviving and needing to attract younger people. With everything, there are cycles and if in fact SXM is on an older generation cycle, with time, that will change like every destination who has put up similar SOS flags.. I personally don't believe the island is in harms way like you suggest. If anything, I think everyone needs to be much more concerned about over development and the lack of dutch regulations with zoning. The island definitely does not need Planet Hollywood, does not need 20 story high-rises and definitely does not need to host SXM SPRING BREAK for the island to live on, be strong and continue to be the fabulous place that we all love.

As I have said, my opinion may not be popular, but as of now, I see no reason to change my opinion. SXM is in a really bad position right now, as far as the budget..

It doesn't really make a difference if a new, "younger generation" branded hotel comes in or if it were to be a Ritz Carlton because it's not only the hotel but the associated amenities of the region that will determine the demographic. I live in beautiful Sarasota County Florida, a coastal area about an hour south of Tampa. The overwhelming demographic here is not the newlywed but rather the nearly dead. For almost 20 years the city of Sarasota hosted a motorcycle event which benefited children. We never had the younger bikers like the annual Daytona biker rallies but more of the urban professionals that enjoy motorcycling as a hobby. The downtown has been enjoying a building boom of million dollar+ condos in the recent past. Unfortunately these wealthy "nearly deads" got the ear of the city commission and complained about the noise and the traffic congestion for the one weekend a year that raised over 5 million dollars in business for the immediate surrounding area hotels, restaurants, suppliers etc and that rally has since been moved to the county fairgrounds where there are no shops, restaurants, waterfront except the fair food trailers that come in. These same people are trying to but the kibosh on a 30 year traditional boat race held every 4th of July weekend too for the same BS reasons. Not too long ago many of the residents were up in arms because that "Girls Gone Wild (GGW)" crew were coming to Sarasota during spring break. Spring break here is a joke in comparison to what the news media portrays it to be in the popular destinations like Cancun, South Padre etc. It is more inline with kids coming here to visit their grandparents for a free week on the beach. When the GGW crew were here it was a total waste of their time because some of their crew were overheard saying that instead of Girls Gone Wild they have found Sarasota to be Grannies Gone Mild. The area of Sarasota just doesn't hold enough interesting things to do for the younger generation and as such it really entice younger people. I believe that same type of thing will hold true in St. Martin. Just my .02